Kato crossover

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Suzdal
Posts: 41
Joined: 17.07.2017, 18:43
Location: Paris & Normandie, France

Kato crossover

Post by Suzdal » 10.12.2018, 17:42

I'm having trouble programming the Kato double Crossover (20-210). It consists of 4 switches and one cable which will change all 4 switches into 2 positions at the same time. I've followed the manual/Wiki to have it display correctly, switches (1,2,3,4 & the center crossing). I've called the switches sw1, sw2, sw3, sw4 and they are all at the SAME address in the "Interface" tab: "Port 5"

When I click on any one of the switch symbols in the track plan, the switch is thrown correctly; however the diagram shows only the clicked upon switch thrown.

How do I get the other 3 symbols to change reflecting the cross over positions ?

Richard

smitt48
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Re: Kato crossover

Post by smitt48 » 10.12.2018, 18:05

Hi Richard,

I would create an action to flip the switches. Some command stations cannot switch 2 switches with the same address.
Does it work in automode correctly?

Tom

Suzdal
Posts: 41
Joined: 17.07.2017, 18:43
Location: Paris & Normandie, France

Re: Kato crossover

Post by Suzdal » 10.12.2018, 19:25

I guess I wasn't clear enough in my explanation, my apologies. All four switches in the Kato double crossover are at the same address and simultaneously flip over correctly.

My problem is to show the 4 switch symbols in the "plan" flipping at the same time.

Richard

LDG
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Re: Kato crossover

Post by LDG » 10.12.2018, 19:32

Hi Richard,

which command station are you using ?

To get all needed information to help please create an issue (Rocview/Help/Issue...) and attach the resulting issue.zip to your next answer.

Lothar

smitt48
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Re: Kato crossover

Post by smitt48 » 10.12.2018, 20:42

Hi Richard,

It took a while, but I found the example.
https://wiki.rocrail.net/doku.php?id=sw ... der_output

Check the example in German, if you need translation help I am available.

Tom

apemberton
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Joined: 05.12.2017, 11:08
Location: West Hertfordshire, UK

Re: Kato crossover

Post by apemberton » 10.12.2018, 23:42

I also have a Kato double crossover (and a couple of singles too). I found a snippet of example code in the Wiki but I cannot remember where. I also used raster graphics to display this crossing.

My crossing works for me by clicking on any of the four individual switches on the plan display. I attach a snippet of my code extracted from my plan which may be of help but it will contain some specific code for my plan. Feel free to use if it helps.

Tony
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Suzdal
Posts: 41
Joined: 17.07.2017, 18:43
Location: Paris & Normandie, France

Re: Kato crossover

Post by Suzdal » 19.12.2018, 10:43

I'm brginning to understand your XML.

A couple of questions:
1. Where in the menus is the <aclist> positioned?
2. Again Where do I position <actionctrl id= "C5cstraight" ...
3. Again Where do I position <actioncond id= "C5c" ...

Richard

Suzdal
Posts: 41
Joined: 17.07.2017, 18:43
Location: Paris & Normandie, France

Re: Kato crossover

Post by Suzdal » 19.12.2018, 14:53

Hi Tom

Sorry for the delay, not feeling at all well .

What you posted looks interesting, unfortunately I don't know a word of German. My languages are just French and English.

When I'm feeling better I'll try and run it trough Google translate.

Richard

smitt48
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Re: Kato crossover

Post by smitt48 » 19.12.2018, 15:45

Hi Richard,

Get well soon!
Simultaneously switched points
The example shows how to set turnouts that are always switched together (both straight or both branching) because both turnouts are connected to the same decoder output. In this case, a switch is assigned to a real decoder address, the other one to a virtual address of the virtual central office. The actions and action conditions ensure that the switching of one switch follows the other.
For this example with 2 switches: create 4 actions, 2 for each switch (straight & turnout).
dual3.PNG
dual2.PNG
By each switch activate the action. On switch 1 you create actions for switch 2, etc.
dual1.PNG
You see here on the left the screen where you can enter an action
In the middle you see the plan consisting of 2 switches
On the right you see how switch 1 activate actions for switch 2.

Also included is the plan, create a new workspace (folder) and copy the plan. Then open Rocrail and select the workspace, now this plan loads into Rocrail. You can now look at all the actions, etc.

Tom
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Suzdal
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Joined: 17.07.2017, 18:43
Location: Paris & Normandie, France

Re: Kato crossover

Post by Suzdal » 19.12.2018, 16:07

Tom

Thanks, that should give me enough to go by when I get my head on back straight

Thanks again

Richard

apemberton
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Location: West Hertfordshire, UK

Re: Kato crossover

Post by apemberton » 20.12.2018, 00:27

Hi Richard,

Sorry, I have only just go round to doing my reply.

I am sure that Tom has covered this thing better because he will be far more experienced in Rocrail! I had only extracted and uploaded the bits of my plan (which in my case is Orscha.xml) that I thought were relevant.

The <aclist> should be in your plan as an action list. I don't think it matters where it occurs within the 'plan.xml' so long as it has the correct .xml syntax. I chose to renumber my switches from the default to something easier to remember, for crossings, I chose a 'C' followed by the crossing number (5) and the individual switches 'a,b,c,d'. The subsequent parts of action control (straight, curved) are as per standard action control dialog. I did not use the action dialog to insert the .xml code but edited it directly in to my plan. This I did externally to Rocrail using XMLcopyeditor ( a Free editor released under the GNU GPL licence) which is good for Windows and Linux.

Hope that bug clears up and happy holidays, Tony

Suzdal
Posts: 41
Joined: 17.07.2017, 18:43
Location: Paris & Normandie, France

Re: Kato crossover

Post by Suzdal » 24.12.2018, 09:31

To Tom & Tony

Thank you both for your replies. I just came back to Paris to day where I have a small test track. My main track is in Normandy, where the wind was gusting up to 94 km./h this past week. I also brought my KATO double crossover back to Paris where I'll connect it to my test setup this week.

Tom, I've duplicated the test plan that you sent me and understand it fairly well. However applying that knowledge to the KATO double cross is causing me lots of problems. I'm sending you 2 plans, hoping you can tell me where I have gone wrong.

For the double crossover my switches are designated cx1,cx2,cx3,c4, the middle one sw005. I'm not using raster images because I don't like the turnout position in the image.

plancx1:
Only cx1 can be thrown, cx2,cx3,cx4 follow with out any problems (I'm not including this one since it works).

plancx1cx2:
Both cx1 & cx2 can be thrown, cx2,cx3,cx4 follow for the first and cx1,cx3,cx4 follow for the second. Here I start to HAVE problems and start having a bunch of error messages.

Errors:
09:11:24 nested action level 10 detected (3 times)
the number of times the other turnouts are flipped becomes much higher cx1(48),cx2(40),cx3(80),c4(80)

If I try and include cx3, I getting over 9000 flips for the turn outs.

Questions:
1. The situation seems to be looping and biting its own tail. What am I doing wrong?
2. Is there any way to get sw005 to change color as a function of the turnout position?

Merry Christmas, Richard
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apemberton
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Location: West Hertfordshire, UK

Re: Kato crossover

Post by apemberton » 24.12.2018, 12:56

Hi Richard, Sounds like a rough day en Normandie! Don't send it over La Manche, we don't want it!

I havn't looked at your plan yet but I make the following unqualified comments about the crossover.

I also have multiple switch actions which results in a short buzz in the Kato crossover. I'm sure that the reason for this is that all four crossings have a command fired at them though there is only one bipolar 'solenoid'. In my case, it is a short lived phenomenon and does not cause a problem as the crossover remains in the same position after the first switch command. I think the buzz is due to the delay interpreting the .xml script, passing the commands through my old Zimo MX1EC and then on through a Lenz accessory decoder.

I suspect your sw005 changing colour will be cured after routes are set between your cx1-cx4 and beyond. Obviously I do not have this problem with raster graphics but I have noted it elsewhere with double main crossovers using single switches and non-switchable crossings. That said, the problem now seems to have 'gone away'!

Happy Christmas, Tony

apemberton
Posts: 91
Joined: 05.12.2017, 11:08
Location: West Hertfordshire, UK

Re: Kato crossover

Post by apemberton » 24.12.2018, 13:34

Further to my last, I was looking through my main plan for reasons unconnected with this subject, and I see that the Rocrail analyser does some interesting things to switches and crossings, generally <stlist>.. <st>blah</st>..</stlist> which is probably why my uncontrolled crossings show routings. Clever stuff! I wonder if that works for your sw005?

Bonne Noel, Tony

Suzdal
Posts: 41
Joined: 17.07.2017, 18:43
Location: Paris & Normandie, France

Re: Kato crossover

Post by Suzdal » 24.12.2018, 14:37

Tony,

Our weather basically comes off the Atlantic or if there is a low over southern England we get storms, highs protected us. When in Normandy I'm about 70 km south of Cherbourg on the west coast across from Jersey.

For the moment nothing on the crossover is connected to my switch controller (Digikeijs electronics), so no buzzes. I've entered different addresses for each of the switches into the plan.xml file. When connected it will just have 1 address, that's the way Kato works.

Once I get all my switches working & connected, the KATO is the last one, I'm not sure what the next step should be, defining routes and blocks I guess. Any suggestions would be welcome.

I'm enclosing a working "pdf" of my track plan. It was drawn with Anyrail. All this has been implemented under Rocrail with all the switches working except for the double crossover.

Cheers

Richard in a windless Paris. :(

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