Settings needed in IB-COM for mixed DCC/Motorola layout

Uhlenbrock new generation CS-Line

Settings needed in IB-COM for mixed DCC/Motorola layout

Postby hclaassens » 30.07.2011, 12:13

I am using a IB-COM as the first command station of a mixed DCC and Motorola layout. With ib-util I've added locos with DCC-28 and Motorola-neu protocol. The switches use the Motorola protocol. I've also changed SO#25 to 3.

I expect the commands to the locos will be refreshed at certain short intervals. So I did the following test: I create a loc window and let the loc drive with a certain speed. Then I take it of the track and put it back on. I expect it will start to drive in a short while. Most of the time it does NOT. :?

I've found that it start driving when rocrail is pinging the slot. :?

So my question is: Is it possible to get it functioning the way I expect it to be and what should I do in the ib-com and in rocrail ?
hclaassens
 

Postby rjversluis » 30.07.2011, 12:42

It looks like the IB-Com does not update the DCCsignal continuously for every active loco. I do not know the IB-Com, but maybe it is some kind of configuration.
Normally a command station should refresh the digital packages for all active locos.
Best Regards, Rob.
:!: PS: Do not forget to attach the usual files.
:!: PS: Nicht vergessen die übliche Dateien an zu hängen.
[ macOS - Linux] - [ N: CBus - CAN-GCA ] - [ 0: RocNetNode - GCA-Pi ]
rjversluis
Site Admin
 

Postby Besra » 30.07.2011, 12:44

Hi Hans,

did you set the "Slot Purge Time" to the value used by the IB? The old IB had 2 minutes by default, so 240 was a good value here. You can use any value higher than 0 and smaller than (or equal to) the purge time of the IB. Very small values will generate needless traffic according to the wiki.

I do not recommend to activate "Slot Ping". Slot Ping will inhibit purging but the IB has a limited amount of memory (or LocoNet slots). Once there's no free slot available the loco may not remain under constant control (the latter is my conclusion, could be wrong but try without pinging slots and a correct purge time).

Best regards
Besra
Maerklin H0, DCC and MM, Intellibox (I) via ULNI, Booster Tams B4, Throttle Digitrax UT4, LocoNet.
Loco decoders: Zimo, Uhlenbrock, Maerklin & ESU.
Rocweb, Win10 32bit & 64bit
Besra
 

Postby hclaassens » 30.07.2011, 17:00

Hi Besra,

I've changed the slot purge time to 240. I've assumed it is not changed. And I've disabled the slot ping. But without success.

Hans



Besra wrote:Hi Hans,

did you set the "Slot Purge Time" to the value used by the IB? The old IB had 2 minutes by default, so 240 was a good value here. You can use any value higher than 0 and smaller than (or equal to) the purge time of the IB. Very small values will generate needless traffic according to the wiki.

I do not recommend to activate "Slot Ping". Slot Ping will inhibit purging but the IB has a limited amount of memory (or LocoNet slots). Once there's no free slot available the loco may not remain under constant control (the latter is my conclusion, could be wrong but try without pinging slots and a correct purge time).

Best regards
Besra
hclaassens
 

Postby Besra » 30.07.2011, 17:34

Hi Hans,

I've changed the slot purge time to 240. I've assumed it is not changed. And I've disabled the slot ping.


assuming you restarted the server after doing so, I'm afraid I have no further ideas about what to do. Anyway, I'll check whether the old IB behaves in the same way.

Best regards
Besra
Maerklin H0, DCC and MM, Intellibox (I) via ULNI, Booster Tams B4, Throttle Digitrax UT4, LocoNet.
Loco decoders: Zimo, Uhlenbrock, Maerklin & ESU.
Rocweb, Win10 32bit & 64bit
Besra
 

Settings needed in IB-COM for mixed DCC/Motorola layout

Postby hclaassens » 13.08.2011, 15:17

Hi everybody,

Is someone using a IB-COM with rocrail? :?: :?:
If so can you please let me know wich settings you are using?

Best regards,
Hans


Besra wrote:Hi Hans,

I've changed the slot purge time to 240. I've assumed it is not changed. And I've disabled the slot ping.


assuming you restarted the server after doing so, I'm afraid I have no further ideas about what to do. Anyway, I'll check whether the old IB behaves in the same way.

Best regards
Besra
hclaassens
 

Postby Besra » 16.08.2011, 22:15

Hello Hans!

Seemingly no IB-Com user is willing to answer - or maybe they're all on holidays.
So what, reading my last answer again I noticed I mixed up something. Of course two minutes equals 120 (seconds), not 240! 240 is the maximum value supported by the IB but that's in minutes! The old IB, as mentioned, has a default of 2 (minutes) thus it may be worth trying 120 (seconds) or somewhat lower in Rocrail.

I wrote:I'll check whether the old IB behaves in the same way.

I tried so, indeed, but gave up because every type and (especially) brand of decoder behaves differently. The Zimo I tested obviously kept the speed info for a longer period of time - more than I was willing to wait for. Trying to cheat by switching to analogue mainly revealed this type of decoder saves both speed (and direction) for digital and analogue separately. That's ql somehow but definitely I can't reproduce your observation this way.

Best regards
Besra
Maerklin H0, DCC and MM, Intellibox (I) via ULNI, Booster Tams B4, Throttle Digitrax UT4, LocoNet.
Loco decoders: Zimo, Uhlenbrock, Maerklin & ESU.
Rocweb, Win10 32bit & 64bit
Besra
 

Re: Settings needed in IB-COM for mixed DCC/Motorola layout

Postby rjversluis » 17.08.2011, 06:29

Hi Hans,

hclaassens wrote:My problem is that the loc commands are not repeated continously. So when there is a bad contact the loc will stop, because it does not receive a command what to do. I agree with you that this is the responsibillity of the command station (ib-com).

But in my situation that does not happen.

I did some further testing with other software in order to see where this problem is caused.

First I've tried with the ib_util on Uhlenbrocks cdrom, with that no problem at all.

Secondly I've got a temporary license key of a dutch package called iTrain, written in java, and no problem at all.

Now I think it must be possible to solve the problem with ib-com and rocrail.

Is there any way we can solve this together, because I think rocrail is a great package with a lot of potential, but has one, for me very annoying, bug. Which makes it unuseable.


Set the purgetime at a minimum and activate slotping.
It seems that other software are pumping the LocoNet bus full with slot commands as a work around for this Command Station and certain decoder types.

hclaassens wrote:First I've tried with the ib_util on Uhlenbrocks cdrom, with that no problem at all.

If you have another LocoNet interface you can sniff the packets with Rocrail in byte mode send by this utility. Uhlenbrock has many undocumented LocoNet commands...
Best Regards, Rob.
:!: PS: Do not forget to attach the usual files.
:!: PS: Nicht vergessen die übliche Dateien an zu hängen.
[ macOS - Linux] - [ N: CBus - CAN-GCA ] - [ 0: RocNetNode - GCA-Pi ]
rjversluis
Site Admin
 

Re: Settings needed in IB-COM for mixed DCC/Motorola layout

Postby hclaassens » 17.08.2011, 06:57

Hi Rob and Besra,

I've seen the problem of not continously sending loc commands when I add a loc to the ib-com with Motorola protocol. That itself is enough for the behaviour of DCC locs.

I don't have another loconet interface to sniffer the packets. Is there someone willing to help me with that? I am willing to travel with my ib-com and laptop to do this test.

best regards,
Hans


rjversluis wrote:If you have another LocoNet interface you can sniff the packets with Rocrail in byte mode send by this utility. Uhlenbrock has many undocumented LocoNet commands...
hclaassens
 

Postby rjversluis » 17.08.2011, 07:12

Hi Hans,

you can ask Peter if he can lend you a MGV85.

I have also more interfaces for testing, but the snail mail from me to you will need about 10 days... Yeah, it's a long way from Germany to the Netherlands. :wink:
Best Regards, Rob.
:!: PS: Do not forget to attach the usual files.
:!: PS: Nicht vergessen die übliche Dateien an zu hängen.
[ macOS - Linux] - [ N: CBus - CAN-GCA ] - [ 0: RocNetNode - GCA-Pi ]
rjversluis
Site Admin
 

Postby hclaassens » 17.08.2011, 07:34

Thanks Rob. I'll send him a pm to ask him

Hans



rjversluis wrote:Hi Hans,

you can ask Peter if he can lend you a MGV85.

I have also more interfaces for testing, but the snail mail from me to you will need about 10 days... Yeah, it's a long way from Germany to the Netherlands. :wink:
hclaassens
 

Postby hclaassens » 22.08.2011, 20:57

Hi Rob,

I've an additional MGV101 connected to my loconet bus of the ib-com. An additional pc with rocrail does the sniffing of the loconet. I have a loc active with address 26 using a DCC 28 step decoder and another one with addr=18 using a delta decoder 14 steps.

I've made 2 trace files: other.trace.trc with another program and rocrail.trace.trc.

I've swiched the track on with rocrail manually and the other was default on. I've given a speed command to the DCC loc and have stopped it again. Then I've switched the track off and saved the trace file.

Allthough I see differences in the 2 trace files, I do not see any undocumented loconet commands except opcode 0x3b in both cases.

Could you please comment on the trace files? If you need more info, let me know.

Best regards,

Hans



hclaassens wrote:Thanks Rob. I'll send him a pm to ask him

Hans



rjversluis wrote:Hi Hans,

you can ask Peter if he can lend you a MGV85.

I have also more interfaces for testing, but the snail mail from me to you will need about 10 days... Yeah, it's a long way from Germany to the Netherlands. :wink:
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.
hclaassens
 

Postby rjversluis » 23.08.2011, 06:21

Hi Hans,

I checked it but see no differences in the used LocoNet commands, so I still believe the other programs are also pinging the slot to make sure the IB-COM will refresh the DCC/MM signal.

Another test to prove this:
- run the other program
- activate a loco with some speed
- let it run for a while and sniffer with the mgv101, but make sure Rocrail does not ping in between ;)
Best Regards, Rob.
:!: PS: Do not forget to attach the usual files.
:!: PS: Nicht vergessen die übliche Dateien an zu hängen.
[ macOS - Linux] - [ N: CBus - CAN-GCA ] - [ 0: RocNetNode - GCA-Pi ]
rjversluis
Site Admin
 

Postby hclaassens » 23.08.2011, 06:45

Hi Rob,

Afterwards I did my test case. Start the loc at some speed, take it of the track and put it back again. In case of the other program it starts running, in case of Rocrail it does not. During the test I didn't sniffer any packets.

Best regards,
Hans


rjversluis wrote:Hi Hans,

I checked it but see no differences in the used LocoNet commands, so I still believe the other programs are also pinging the slot to make sure the IB-COM will refresh the DCC/MM signal.

Another test to prove this:
- run the other program
- activate a loco with some speed
- let it run for a while and sniffer with the mgv101, but make sure Rocrail does not ping in between ;)
hclaassens
 

Postby rjversluis » 23.08.2011, 07:29

Hi Hans,

the other program does at start a read on slot zero which is the dispatch slot. But if this will keep the IB-Com refreshing....
Best Regards, Rob.
:!: PS: Do not forget to attach the usual files.
:!: PS: Nicht vergessen die übliche Dateien an zu hängen.
[ macOS - Linux] - [ N: CBus - CAN-GCA ] - [ 0: RocNetNode - GCA-Pi ]
rjversluis
Site Admin
 

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